View Full Version : Shortage of Nurse in US


Stellathomas
07-22-2008, 04:01 AM
US is experiencing with a more severe shortage of registered nurses in certain areas. It is all because of the growing population and a third of the aging nurses is preparing to retire and there are not enough nurses to replace them. Resources says that there will be a shortage of 213,500 registered nurses in 2010 in US.

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Stellathomas
Social Media Marketing (http://www.inspire-itsolutions.com)

P/J
07-22-2008, 08:41 PM
Do you have a question?
What is your opinion on this?

Should they be opening more places for students in nursing schools? There have been a number of posts from pre-nursing students who have been trying to get into nursing schools for years. Without knowing the reason for initially turning them away, should more places be available or pre-reqs included in the course?

Julie
07-23-2008, 03:35 AM
I think this is a valuable thread (although the way it is started is odd to say the least - and mau be related to the advert below, though I reserve judgement).

Across the world there is a shortage of nurses, a lack of young people who want to join the profession and stay at the bedside but at the same time it is increasingly difficult to get into nursing schools and in many places the drop out rates are high. It would be great to get some debate going on this issue.

miss-elaine-ious
07-26-2008, 03:48 AM
I think it has a lot to do with the perceived notion that nurses are the ones who 'receive' orders versus give them...

Back in the day when I first went to university I wanted to be an MD. I dismissed nursing because I thought I would have to "take orders" all the time. Now that I'm a nurse I realize the opportunities for independent practice, as well the inherent responsibility nurses have for education/health promotion/illness treatment and much more.

As a former pre-med, I highly recommend that nursing recruiters focus on the people who are interested in medicine but don't realize that they can 'help people' (the most common reason why people say they want to be a doc) through nursing. There are 2 year degree nursing schools popping up all the time (in Ontario, Canada) for exactly that reason, people going to university for pre-med and changing their minds 2-3 years in.

Thoughts?

Elaine :cheers:
--------------
http://miss-elaine-ious.blogspot.com/

Fitlinechamp
07-30-2008, 07:52 PM
Bedside Nursing was taken away because of:

RN's moving out from hospital to the field. Rationale: one-to-one ratio, good pay, less strenuous.
Travel Nursing: Lucrative pay and incentives, paid travel and accomodation.
Career Advancement: NP, Nurse Anesthetist, Masteral Degree, Doctorates, Administrative Positions, Informaticist and other upgrades.
Experienced RN retiring early. Rationale: Burn out from (physical, mental and emotional exhaustion), Mandatory Overtime, Too much occupational hazard, Work Related Injury/sickness, high acuity and ratio.

Solutions;


Implement appropriate Nurse-Patient ratio all across US.
Encouraged semi-retired RN's to come back to workforce (provide re-entry training program)
Hire the newly graduates and provide adequate mentoring/training program


Will this solve the crisis?

Probably not, but it's certainly is the most immediately available resource, the easiest, most affordable and more realistic approach to cover the shortage while attempts are made to improve the number of Faculties to admit, educate and train more nursing students.

Most hospitals are investing thousands on sign on bonus to attract experience Nurses...for what?

To encourage them to jump out from one hospital and move to a better paying hospital?

That's not a fix!:boxing:

If a hospital can afford a sign on bonus of 10-14K per RN...why not spend that money on re-entry training and newly graduate mentoring program.

Add more funds for additional RN's to meet the appropriate Nurse-Patient ratio.

California implemented 1:4. Skeptics says it will create more shortage. Truth is..more Nurses move to California for that reason. Now their vacancy rate is lower than most states.

They think that RN's can be lured by bigger pay and bonuses...it certainly attracts but not enough to make them stay when their physically and mentally beaten day-in and day-out.

Most of us want to work for the money, but if we can only work for short term and end up disable for longer term due to occupational hazards involve...don't know about you but for me---I'd rather do somethin' else with a lesser pay.

A quick check on the registry of inactive licenses will provide a clearer picture that there is indeed a large pool of qualified RN's sitting on their license watching the crisis unfold.

Not that they don't care to help...RN's by nature are compassionate and caring...we took that oath didn't we and we were led to believe that it is indeed a noble profession.

But when you've worked 12 hours and get mandated to stay another 4 to take care of 10-12 patients, I think it goes beyond the call of duty.

Shortage Crisis? Mmmmm...

Maybe the Nurses are trying to send a message...we deserve more than just a higher pay!:dancing2:

Just my 2 cents...and more.

Mother Jones, RN
07-31-2008, 12:37 AM
Bedside Nursing was taken away because of:

RN's moving out from hospital to the field. Rationale: one-to-one ratio, good pay, less strenuous.
Travel Nursing: Lucrative pay and incentives, paid travel and accomodation.
Career Advancement: NP, Nurse Anesthetist, Masteral Degree, Doctorates, Administrative Positions, Informaticist and other upgrades.
Experienced RN retiring early. Rationale: Burn out from (physical, mental and emotional exhaustion), Mandatory Overtime, Too much occupational hazard, Work Related Injury/sickness, high acuity and ratio.

Solutions;


Implement appropriate Nurse-Patient ratio all across US.
Encouraged semi-retired RN's to come back to workforce (provide re-entry training program)
Hire the newly graduates and provide adequate mentoring/training program


Will this solve the crisis?

Probably not, but it's certainly is the most immediately available resource, the easiest, most affordable and more realistic approach to cover the shortage while attempts are made to improve the number of Faculties to admit, educate and train more nursing students.

Most hospitals are investing thousands on sign on bonus to attract experience Nurses...for what?

To encourage them to jump out from one hospital and move to a better paying hospital?

That's not a fix!:boxing:

If a hospital can afford a sign on bonus of 10-14K per RN...why not spend that money on re-entry training and newly graduate mentoring program.

Add more funds for additional RN's to meet the appropriate Nurse-Patient ratio.

California implemented 1:4. Skeptics says it will create more shortage. Truth is..more Nurses move to California for that reason. Now their vacancy rate is lower than most states.

They think that RN's can be lured by bigger pay and bonuses...it certainly attracts but not enough to make them stay when their physically and mentally beaten day-in and day-out.

Most of us want to work for the money, but if we can only work for short term and end up disable for longer term due to occupational hazards involve...don't know about you but for me---I'd rather do somethin' else with a lesser pay.

A quick check on the registry of inactive licenses will provide a clearer picture that there is indeed a large pool of qualified RN's sitting on their license watching the crisis unfold.

Not that they don't care to help...RN's by nature are compassionate and caring...we took that oath didn't we and we were led to believe that it is indeed a noble profession.

But when you've worked 12 hours and get mandated to stay another 4 to take care of 10-12 patients, I think it goes beyond the call of duty.

Shortage Crisis? Mmmmm...

Maybe the Nurses are trying to send a message...we deserve more than just a higher pay!:dancing2:

Just my 2 cents...and more.


All very excellent points. Burnout is playing a huge role in the nursing shortage. Working short for long hours really does go beyond the call of duty. The problem is complex, and it's going to take a lot of time and MONEY to fix it.

MJ :pepsi:

P/J
07-31-2008, 04:48 AM
Good points. We have a lot of nurses who left due to working conditions and leaving to have kids. They are now trying to get them back, however their practice has often lapsed. By offering back to work programs, where the nurse works with a preceptor to return to work. However many of these nurses are in their late 40s and 50s. Although there is no compulsory 'end' to their career, many nurses are leaving at retire.

Our state has nursing ratios (1:4 in public acute), our pay is also governed by a state wide EBA. I believe we are the only state to have this, and in other states they are having problems keeping nurses.

Do we work for love or money? Or do we do it for a mixture of the two? I know that there is a level that I am willing to work at for the salary which is offered. I am willing to work in harder circumstances for more, but there is a level which this stops. There is no point in working yourself to burn-out just for more money.

Mother Jones, RN
07-31-2008, 04:06 PM
Good points. We have a lot of nurses who left due to working conditions and leaving to have kids. They are now trying to get them back, however their practice has often lapsed. By offering back to work programs, where the nurse works with a preceptor to return to work. However many of these nurses are in their late 40s and 50s. Although there is no compulsory 'end' to their career, many nurses are leaving at retire.

Our state has nursing ratios (1:4 in public acute), our pay is also governed by a state wide EBA. I believe we are the only state to have this, and in other states they are having problems keeping nurses.

Do we work for love or money? Or do we do it for a mixture of the two? I know that there is a level that I am willing to work at for the salary which is offered. I am willing to work in harder circumstances for more, but there is a level which this stops. There is no point in working yourself to burn-out just for more money.

I served as a preceptor to a nurse who had left the profession to raise her kids. She had a heck of a time jumping through hoops when she wanted to reinstate her nursing license. She had to take some very expensive nursing classes at our local community college, and work for free on my unit for three months. The board of nursing call this time her “practicum.” I called it crazy. And people wonder why nurses are anxious to come back to work once they take time off from the profession.

MJ :pepsi:

P/J
08-01-2008, 11:17 PM
I can't comment on the cost, but there was a big promotion for trained nurses to return into the industry. Having worked with them and their preceptors, the preceptors find it frustrating due to deficits in knowledge.

More effort is now being placed in training new nurses, rather than retraining old ones.:pound:

Mr Ian
08-11-2008, 11:47 AM
Nursing shortages aren't just about a lack of nurses.
(Yes I know what I'm talking about dammit! It just appears I'm stupid)

We cannot fix the nursing shortage by throwing more and more money at it - it would be great - and it would work, in the short term - but the money then comes from somewhere else and the cost would be lose beds; or paramedical staff; or access to best treatments and then all those extra nurses just have to work harder anyhow.

What I believe needs to change is to first recognise nursing (and other health care staff - who can get their own forum) is a global issue and is no different a problem than greenhouse gases and ozone layers.
One significant factor - where I am, they only employ RNs and ENs. They do not like HCAs for some reason. They will not employ them unless they have a suitable qualification; which is commendable - but hardly helps the resource problem especially when accessing suitable courses is difficult.
The issue then with this is we drive hard to recruit more nurses... and they come... from your hospital to mine. So now you have less nurses. So you have to make yourself more attractive.... ad infinitum.
I don't begrudge nurses having this self-propagating circular development - doctors have got away with it for years; negotiating 30 hours a week off for study leave and the rest of the time in private practice.

What we need to do:
1. Make nursing (and other health care) a more attractive outcome - lucrative pensions and retirement benefits. I'd work my arse off if I knew I had nothing to worry about in retirement - regardless of job. Give me a comfortable wage but make it worth me doing in the long run and I'll stay for the long run.
2. Change the way we apply ourselves - and this is happening in many areas, much to the disgust of some doctors who insist nurses should remain at the bedside; bedpan in hand. Nurses need to be more ruthless in their tasking: It's nice to spend the time doing the nursing duties like feeding and making beds while chatting to patients and assisting to toilet - but we need to be able to task others up with this when 'nursing' is not wholly required.
3. Recruit more LPN/EN level staff and stop focussing on RNs. Then provide abridged and easily accessible conversion courses to attain RN at a later date - and recognise that the EN is doing us a favour by upskilling - not us doing them a favour.
4. Subsidise the nurse training in EN and for the conversion to RN. Direct entry RN would be fine to leave as is - ie self funding and at full cost - otherwise too many people would do it cos it's a free/cheap degree and then go somewhere else.
5. Give nurses the recognition that nursing groups make up more than the collective numbers of all other professions in health care combined. Empower nurses to manage the politics and organisation of their ward/clinical area - because they care about their workplace and are patient care driven - which is what patients want.
6. Free espresso.

Jenn Foster
08-11-2008, 06:34 PM
Another part of the problem to the nursing shortage (now and in the future) is the insufficient number of nurse educators. The forecasts for nurse educators over the next 12 years is alarming and maybe the cause for the nursing shortage panic and the potential shortage of nurses. It is true that many potential qualified nursing students are being turned away due to schools of nursing being filled to capacity.

The industry is in need and is seeking/calling experienced nurses that maybe ready for a change in their career path or lifestyle to consider becoming a nurse educator. This could be especially rewarding to those that are looking to recommit to their vocation by perpetuating their unique gifts and talents to hundreds of future nurses.

It may also be an option for those that have left the nursing field ready to return.

For those in Pennsylvania, please see my blog and the "Futures in Nursing" weblink below.

http://pennsylvanianurses.blogspot.com/
http://www.futuresinnursing.org/aid/special_programs_educators.shtml

Mother Jones, RN
08-12-2008, 10:28 AM
You bring up very important points. I make more money at the hospital than I could has a nurse educator at one of our local colleges. We need more money for nursing education.

MJ :pepsi:

Chrissy67
08-12-2008, 02:42 PM
The statistics are alarming concerning the shortage of nurses, not only now, but in the immediate future. I live in Pennsylvania and our problem (not unlike most other states) is that our nursing schools are turning away potential nurses due to the lack of nursing educators.

There is an organization in PA that is offering financial assistance, scholarships, and grants to current nurses looking to become nurse educators.

If you live in PA and are looking for a little change in direction with your nursing experience, you should check out the PHEF.

http://www.higheredfoundation.org/programs/index.shtml

Jenn Foster
08-13-2008, 02:26 PM
Dear MJ,

How do we remedy? I do believe there are nurses that would trade off the money for a better quality of life and something more fulfilling; it's a matter of awareness for those potential candidates. Having said that, I don't dispute the disparity that exists. How do we close the gap? My immediate thought is some kind of co-op between schools of nursing and neighboring facilities. I have some ideas, but I don't know what would be fair and equitable. I believe both could benefit with some kind of program that would divert funding into a co-op.

Jenn

Mother Jones, RN
08-13-2008, 03:12 PM
Dear MJ,

How do we remedy? I do believe there are nurses that would trade off the money for a better quality of life and something more fulfilling; it's a matter of awareness for those potential candidates. Having said that, I don't dispute the disparity that exists. How do we close the gap? My immediate thought is some kind of co-op between schools of nursing and neighboring facilities. I have some ideas, but I don't know what would be fair and equitable. I believe both could benefit with some kind of program that would divert funding into a co-op.

Jenn

I really don't know what would be the first step to solving the nursing shortage. Nurses living in a single parent household need the money in order to support their kids, and nurses like me can't afford to retire because of the cost of living. I'd love to trade off money for a better life, but I can't. That's the one thing that keeps a lot of people in nurse.

Back in the old days of nursing, every nursing school was tied to a hospital. We worked our butts off, but in return we received a great education at an affordable price. More students could go to nursing school because it wasn't overly expensive to attend.

MJ :pepsi:

Julie
08-14-2008, 03:17 AM
The problem we seem to face is the value placed on nursing. While nursing practice has become ever more complex and challenging, while we have taken on greater responsibility the value placed on us by others seems to have reduced. Equally little value is placed upon those who teach nurses, in the UK a job in nurse education would likely lead to lower pay than at the bedside or in management.

Mr Ian
08-15-2008, 07:11 AM
.. in the UK a job in nurse education would likely lead to lower pay than at the bedside or in management.
Is that not just reflective that the course they provide is generally crap? And that post-grad preceptors tend to get the new grads up to speed on the reality of the situation?

I'd be happy for nurse educators to get a decent pay - for a decent job done. I'm not sure what the pay difference is - as my nurse educator is on a higher rate than me (I'm upper supervisor level - he's lower management) - but I take home more due to shift loading etc. Plus I earn more than he does.

Julie
08-15-2008, 08:01 AM
I am not sure that it would be true to say that all nurse educators are 'crap' or that the courses are equally rubbish. It would be true to say that if better quality people were attracted into education or into combined practice / education roles then courses could be better than they currently are.

JacquiBee
10-16-2008, 08:41 PM
I feel that one of the key reasons that there is a nursing shortage is that people other than nurses are making decions about how nursing work will be done, what nurses are worth, and how nurses and nursing are portrayed in the wider world. When my mother started her hospital based nursing training in about 1958 the choices for womens work were more limited, you could say most women felt they could choose from a handful of careers including nursing. These days both young women and men can choose from any and all careers so nursing needs to seen as a fulfilling alternative in all ways not just the personal satisfaction of providing excellent care.
My fav concept is participation, that is in order to make improvments, to create change one has to participate in things. This begins with working as a nurse, this is participation, so you are then the "expert" in your area who has insight and can comment on what is good or bad, what works, what doesn't. If you then become involved you can create improvements from the ground up so to speak. It might be that you use your vote to influence govt, (in New Zealand nurses have a poor voter turn out), you might belong and be active in your union, you might be an educator, invoved in quality improvment and so many more ways to be involved (as so many nurses already are). The more of us standing together in support of one another the easier it will be. I truly feel if nurses organised how nursing was managed and payed and staffed and described to the world it would be a more satisfing job with less frustrations and burnout and we would attract more young nurses.
:( In memory of a dedicated, passionate, inspiring nurse who tragically passed away this week but who had participated vigorously and inspired me to do the same

eholistic
10-20-2008, 08:02 PM
Hello. I was wondering if anyone knows of any types of nursing models on perhaps a med/surg unit to where the NT/CNA's actually have a Charge Tech. One who works daily, without a patient assignment. Job tasks would be to answer call bells, meet and greet and even do the patient admission for the tech part that is. Relieve others for lunch. Help with q2 turns, run to the bed alarms ringing. Be as a mentor to the new techs to help with organizing and looking at the whole patient rather than just being task oriented.. the list could go on. I see this as a reduction on wounds, patient falls, staff disatisfaction, patient complaints and the list again could go on and on. I would like to see this on my unit but would LOVE to find a model to mirror to help with making this happen. Someone please do share!

Thanks so much!
Eholistic

Mr Ian
10-21-2008, 12:31 PM
Hi eholistic

I remember an old model that seems similar to the one you describe only they weren't called charge techs - they were called Sister or Matron. They seemed to manage all the above and quite a bit more.

MyOwnWoman
11-09-2008, 11:48 AM
What's an EN?

P/J
11-09-2008, 05:32 PM
What's an EN?

I can't see where you saw it, I think you mean EN as in 'Enrolled Nurse' which is about equivalent to an LPN. They work under the supervision of an RN but they have a year of nursing training.

JacquiBee
11-17-2008, 07:05 PM
An Enrolled nurse is a second level nurse. they work under the supervision of an RN. their scope of practice varies on where and when they trained. We have them in New Zealand and Australia and I don't know where else

malenurse354
12-24-2012, 01:10 AM
Recently, I’ve read an article which says that nursing shortage in the US is already over!

jamie876
01-10-2013, 10:37 AM
recent news reported that nursing shortage is already over!so what will happen to the flock of nursing who are going to join the workforce????